First a tes: previous ticket that cost me half an hour to type was lost due to a 403 error upon submitting...
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#99 – Issue with Multilingual site (new language added to single-language site)
Posted in ‘sh404SEF’
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Kloostra
Kloostra
I have an issue with a multilingual site. It was set-up as single language (english) site for 2 years, but now I want to add a second language (dutch). I created all menu's and content using instructions as provided here: http://anything-digital.com/getting-started-with-native-multilingual-web-sites-in-joomla.html (Josetta was used for translations). Note that I set-up the default language to show without an english language string, to prevent changed URL's, I only want the dutch articles to have a /nl/ string.
I have set-up the language filter, see attachment, and the language switcher module. No changes were done in SH404SEF, I understood there are no language specific parameters anymore, except for one or two minor ones.
Some of the menu's had to be re-saved outside Josetta, but then the site seemed to work, as far as navigating trough the menu was concerned. All links with a direct menu worked correctly.
However, many articles are only accessible through either a category-list view menu-item or a module with a category-list. This is where things go wrong. It seems in those cases the language string is not inserted. See 2 examples here, the first one for an article accessed through a category list and the second one set-up as a direct menu-item:
- http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/SEO-Checklist/301-redirects
- http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/SEO-Checklist/301-redirects
Note the /nl/
Can you tell me what's wrong?
You can access the site through http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo (with a popup: user: xxxx, password: xxxx)
I have set-up the language filter, see attachment, and the language switcher module. No changes were done in SH404SEF, I understood there are no language specific parameters anymore, except for one or two minor ones.
Some of the menu's had to be re-saved outside Josetta, but then the site seemed to work, as far as navigating trough the menu was concerned. All links with a direct menu worked correctly.
However, many articles are only accessible through either a category-list view menu-item or a module with a category-list. This is where things go wrong. It seems in those cases the language string is not inserted. See 2 examples here, the first one for an article accessed through a category list and the second one set-up as a direct menu-item:
- http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/SEO-Checklist/301-redirects
- http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/SEO-Checklist/301-redirects
Note the /nl/
Can you tell me what's wrong?
You can access the site through http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo (with a popup: user: xxxx, password: xxxx)
Kloostra
wb_weeblr
Hi
Sorry about the missed ticket, not sure about what to say the 403 though?
With respect to ML sites, you didn't mention which J! version you're running, but we've had much trouble since J! 3.4+, especially 3.4.1, which has at least one serious issue regaring language filter (which I hope to be able to report soon!).
In any case, could you please update to current dev version, available from https://copy.com/xxxx.
It's been available for a few days now, and looks good so far, it has a workarounds for all known issue in J! 3. You'll have to purge URLs after installing it.
The difference in URLS based on whether an item is linked from a menu is a bit new though.
Let me know
Rgds
Sorry about the missed ticket, not sure about what to say the 403 though?
With respect to ML sites, you didn't mention which J! version you're running, but we've had much trouble since J! 3.4+, especially 3.4.1, which has at least one serious issue regaring language filter (which I hope to be able to report soon!).
In any case, could you please update to current dev version, available from https://copy.com/xxxx.
It's been available for a few days now, and looks good so far, it has a workarounds for all known issue in J! 3. You'll have to purge URLs after installing it.
The difference in URLS based on whether an item is linked from a menu is a bit new though.
Let me know
Rgds
Kloostra
Hi, I did not have time to check thoroughly, as it's weekend ;)
Both Joomla and all my extensions were already up to date with the latest releases. Anyhow, the fix seems to work fine as per your instructions. Great work.
Also, it seems after purging my URL's metadata are still available, so that's good too.
Thanks for providing the fix, and if next week there is anything else I find I keep you updated.
Have a nice weekend too.
Regards,
Simon
Both Joomla and all my extensions were already up to date with the latest releases. Anyhow, the fix seems to work fine as per your instructions. Great work.
Also, it seems after purging my URL's metadata are still available, so that's good too.
Thanks for providing the fix, and if next week there is anything else I find I keep you updated.
Have a nice weekend too.
Regards,
Simon
wb_weeblr
Hi
Yes, meta data (and aliases and a few other thigs) are attached to the non-sef urls, not to the SEF URLs, exactly for this reason.
Rgds
Yes, meta data (and aliases and a few other thigs) are attached to the non-sef urls, not to the SEF URLs, exactly for this reason.
Rgds
Kloostra
Ok, after checking thoroughly, I can confirm all is fie indeed. When will this release go out officially? I am building up a new version of my site based on this release, and I prefer to only publish it when the official release is out.
wb_weeblr
I'm trying to stop answering tickets so that I can publish it ;)
Rgds
Rgds
Kloostra
I see you managed to publish the new release ;)
Just one more thing I noticed, not sure if it is related to SH404SEF: If I am looking at the breadcrumb trail, it looks fine for the base language. However, for the translation (dutch) the home menu is pointing to the article attached to the home-menu-item for the all-languages menu (which should not be accessible), and not to the dutch home menu (the nl string is inserted though). The other parts of the trail show correctly.
The home entry shown is http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/home-all-languages
home-all-languages is the default article for the all languages menu.
If you want to view the site: user: xxxx and passowrd xxxx for the popup.
Just one more thing I noticed, not sure if it is related to SH404SEF: If I am looking at the breadcrumb trail, it looks fine for the base language. However, for the translation (dutch) the home menu is pointing to the article attached to the home-menu-item for the all-languages menu (which should not be accessible), and not to the dutch home menu (the nl string is inserted though). The other parts of the trail show correctly.
The home entry shown is http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/home-all-languages
home-all-languages is the default article for the all languages menu.
If you want to view the site: user: xxxx and passowrd xxxx for the popup.
wb_weeblr
Hi Simon
Can you confirm behavior is correct with Joomla SEF only (ie simply disable sh404SEF "URL optimization from control panel)?
The release was required, due to the Google Analytics user/password access method stopping to work on April 21!
Rgds
Can you confirm behavior is correct with Joomla SEF only (ie simply disable sh404SEF "URL optimization from control panel)?
The release was required, due to the Google Analytics user/password access method stopping to work on April 21!
Rgds
Kloostra
Hi, with SH404SEF switched off the issue does not occurr, so it is indeed caused by SH404SEF it seems. This issue could also have been in earlier releases, this is the first time I'm building a ML site with SH404SEF.
A second issue I noticed is that when being on the homepage and I switch languages, I am not redirected to other languages homepage, but to the page for the corresponding article:
- Homepage = http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/
- Switch to dutch: should be http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/, but is actually http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
The second issue is no big deal, since I will redirect those URLs to the real home anyhow, but it is not correct behaviour. Also this goes well with Joomla core.
A second issue I noticed is that when being on the homepage and I switch languages, I am not redirected to other languages homepage, but to the page for the corresponding article:
- Homepage = http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/
- Switch to dutch: should be http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/, but is actually http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
The second issue is no big deal, since I will redirect those URLs to the real home anyhow, but it is not correct behaviour. Also this goes well with Joomla core.
wb_weeblr
This is absolutely not normal, should not happen, does not happen usually and is the sign of something deeply wrong.
Are you sure you purged all URLs after updating to current 4.4.9?
Rgds
Are you sure you purged all URLs after updating to current 4.4.9?
Rgds
Kloostra
Yes. Just to be sure I purged the URL's once more. If I recheck, I still have the same situation.
Kloostra
Hi, I just found out that the incorrect breadcrumbs were generated by the extension I use: Microdata Google Breadcrumbs... The core function works fine.
Any clue though about the language switch which redirect to the article attached to Home instead of the real homepage?
Any clue though about the language switch which redirect to the article attached to Home instead of the real homepage?
wb_weeblr
Hi
1 - Are you really talking about a redirect? or just that the URL displayed is wrong?
2 - This is usually linked to how the menu item itself is created. What's this link exactly? I mean the non-sef version, that's the only thing that counts, the SEF version is just a consequence of that
Rgds
1 - Are you really talking about a redirect? or just that the URL displayed is wrong?
2 - This is usually linked to how the menu item itself is created. What's this link exactly? I mean the non-sef version, that's the only thing that counts, the SEF version is just a consequence of that
Rgds
Kloostra
Hi, sorry, this ticket is a bit of a mixup of several issues, but my only isue left is this one:
When I am on the homepage and I switch languages, I am not redirected to the dutch homepage, but to the page for the corresponding article:
- Homepage = http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/
- If I click the dutch flag now, I should get http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/, but actually I get http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
When I am on the homepage and I switch languages, I am not redirected to the dutch homepage, but to the page for the corresponding article:
- Homepage = http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/
- If I click the dutch flag now, I should get http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/, but actually I get http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
wb_weeblr
Hi
I understood what you meant and my two questions still stand.
Question 1 - To be more clear, there are 2 things to distinguish:
- the URL produced and displayed (on the flags) as seen when hovering over the flags
- where you end up after clicking them (Joomla language filter does additional redirects usually, so you don't end up where the URL was initially in the flag)
Question 2 - I need the non-sef URLs, to be sure there are no Itemid mix ups. Also, you didn't mention it, but you do have 3 "home pages"? one for EN, one for NL and one for "All" language?
If not, set a home page for those languages that don't have them, then purge URLs
Rgds
I understood what you meant and my two questions still stand.
Question 1 - To be more clear, there are 2 things to distinguish:
- the URL produced and displayed (on the flags) as seen when hovering over the flags
- where you end up after clicking them (Joomla language filter does additional redirects usually, so you don't end up where the URL was initially in the flag)
Question 2 - I need the non-sef URLs, to be sure there are no Itemid mix ups. Also, you didn't mention it, but you do have 3 "home pages"? one for EN, one for NL and one for "All" language?
If not, set a home page for those languages that don't have them, then purge URLs
Rgds
Kloostra
OK:
Question 1 - To be more clear, there are 2 things to distinguish:
- the URL produced and displayed (on the flags) as seen when hovering over the flags:
ANSWER SIMON
This depends on the active language.
When I'm on the english default page, the URL's observed when hovering the flags are:
- English flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/
- Dutch flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
When I am on the dutch homepage:
- English flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/all-yu-need-to-know-about-joomla-and-seo
- Dutch flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/
END ANSWER SIMON
- where you end up after clicking them (Joomla language filter does additional redirects usually, so you don't end up where the URL was initially in the flag)
ANSWER SIMON
No redirects take place, the URL seen when hovering is also the URL I am taken to
END ANSWER SIMON
Question 2 - I need the non-sef URLs, to be sure there are no Itemid mix ups.
ANSWER SIMON
Homepage english: index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1&Itemid=101&lang=en
Homepage dutch: index.php?option=com_content&id=112&view=article&Itemid=475&lang=nl
END ANSWER SIMON
Also, you didn't mention it, but you do have 3 "home pages"? one for EN, one for NL and one for "All" language?
If not, set a home page for those languages that don't have them, then purge URLs
ANSWER SIMON
I have already set things up like this, with correct item-associations
END ANSWER SIMON
Is this the information you need?
Question 1 - To be more clear, there are 2 things to distinguish:
- the URL produced and displayed (on the flags) as seen when hovering over the flags:
ANSWER SIMON
This depends on the active language.
When I'm on the english default page, the URL's observed when hovering the flags are:
- English flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/
- Dutch flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
When I am on the dutch homepage:
- English flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/all-yu-need-to-know-about-joomla-and-seo
- Dutch flag: http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/
END ANSWER SIMON
- where you end up after clicking them (Joomla language filter does additional redirects usually, so you don't end up where the URL was initially in the flag)
ANSWER SIMON
No redirects take place, the URL seen when hovering is also the URL I am taken to
END ANSWER SIMON
Question 2 - I need the non-sef URLs, to be sure there are no Itemid mix ups.
ANSWER SIMON
Homepage english: index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1&Itemid=101&lang=en
Homepage dutch: index.php?option=com_content&id=112&view=article&Itemid=475&lang=nl
END ANSWER SIMON
Also, you didn't mention it, but you do have 3 "home pages"? one for EN, one for NL and one for "All" language?
If not, set a home page for those languages that don't have them, then purge URLs
ANSWER SIMON
I have already set things up like this, with correct item-associations
END ANSWER SIMON
Is this the information you need?
wb_weeblr
Well, what I meant was, if we take:
http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
What are ALL the non-sef URL associated with it in the sh404SEF URL manager?
By All I mean the one listed next to it, but also all duplicates that may be showing in the "Duplicates" column.
Likewise for http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/all-yu-need-to-know-about-joomla-and-seo.
If you get those long URLs instead of homepage, it's because the non-sef link used by the language filter is not recognized as home page, ie the Itemid is not the correct one.
If we can't find something this way, I may have to get access and review things, if OK with you.
Rgds
PS: you normally don't need item or menu associations for home pages, it's the fact that they're declared as home pages that constitues associations.
http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla
What are ALL the non-sef URL associated with it in the sh404SEF URL manager?
By All I mean the one listed next to it, but also all duplicates that may be showing in the "Duplicates" column.
Likewise for http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/all-yu-need-to-know-about-joomla-and-seo.
If you get those long URLs instead of homepage, it's because the non-sef link used by the language filter is not recognized as home page, ie the Itemid is not the correct one.
If we can't find something this way, I may have to get access and review things, if OK with you.
Rgds
PS: you normally don't need item or menu associations for home pages, it's the fact that they're declared as home pages that constitues associations.
Kloostra
Ok, sorry for misunderstanding, here you go:
all-yu-need-to-know-about-joomla-and-seo:
index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=101&catid=2&id=1&lang=en&view=article (no duplicates)
nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla:
index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=475&catid=19&id=112&lang=nl&view=article (no duplicates)
If you need access, no problem , let me know.
all-yu-need-to-know-about-joomla-and-seo:
index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=101&catid=2&id=1&lang=en&view=article (no duplicates)
nl/ongecategoriseerd/zoekmachine-performance-tips-voor-joomla:
index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=475&catid=19&id=112&lang=nl&view=article (no duplicates)
If you need access, no problem , let me know.
wb_weeblr
Yes, superadmin access would help, otherwise I'll just keep asking questions..
Kloostra
Ok, no problem:
First you will get a pop-up to access the folder. To bypass, use:
user: xxxx
password: xxxx
Then the Joomla administrator page at http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/administrator/index.php?utrecht:
User: xxxx
password: xxxx
Just to be sure I just created a backup, so go ahead.
First you will get a pop-up to access the folder. To bypass, use:
user: xxxx
password: xxxx
Then the Joomla administrator page at http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/administrator/index.php?utrecht:
User: xxxx
password: xxxx
Just to be sure I just created a backup, so go ahead.
wb_weeblr
Hi Simon,
Can't get through, I assume the admin side security code is not correct, I'm redirected to frontend home page
Can't get through, I assume the admin side security code is not correct, I'm redirected to frontend home page
Kloostra
I have removed the token, please use http://xxxx.nl/joomlaseo/administrator
wb_weeblr
Hi
Just by looking at the settings, I can't see why it's doing that. The site setup is pretty straightforward, it's only joomla content, menu structure seems fine.
Is it ok with you if I download a backup to install locally and step through the code?
Rgds
Just by looking at the settings, I can't see why it's doing that. The site setup is pretty straightforward, it's only joomla content, menu structure seems fine.
Is it ok with you if I download a backup to install locally and step through the code?
Rgds
Kloostra
no problem, just grab the latest backup in Akeeba, I made it just a few minutes ago.
wb_weeblr
OK, will get back to you
Kloostra
Take it easy, monday is a holiday here. Have a nice weekend.
wb_weeblr
Hi
So the problem was that you had not only associated the home menu items, but also each articles themselves. But when one associates 2 articles together, the non-sef URL used to do the connection is different, it has the category id in it, which prevented sh404SEF to recognize this as a home page.
The Dutch home page was supposed to be: index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=475&id=112&lang=nl&view=article
But the language module was pulling in:
index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=475&catid=19&id=112&lang=nl&view=article
with catid=19, and this wasn't recognized as home.
So if you simply delete that URL, and unassociate both the home menu items, and the articles, language module starts to works as expected.
I'll investgate, I have no idea why the Joomla module is not pulling in the same URL when you associate menus and when you associates articles.
Rgds
So the problem was that you had not only associated the home menu items, but also each articles themselves. But when one associates 2 articles together, the non-sef URL used to do the connection is different, it has the category id in it, which prevented sh404SEF to recognize this as a home page.
The Dutch home page was supposed to be: index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=475&id=112&lang=nl&view=article
But the language module was pulling in:
index.php?option=com_content&Itemid=475&catid=19&id=112&lang=nl&view=article
with catid=19, and this wasn't recognized as home.
So if you simply delete that URL, and unassociate both the home menu items, and the articles, language module starts to works as expected.
I'll investgate, I have no idea why the Joomla module is not pulling in the same URL when you associate menus and when you associates articles.
Rgds
Kloostra
Perfect, it works now. Thanks a lot for the hard work.
As a consolidation, I am working a bit on promoting SH404SEF. I have self-published this book: http://www.amazon.com/Joomla-SEO-Performance-Simon-Kloostra/dp/1500478288
However, this book will be published by profesional publishers next month: Apress (English) and a known dutch one. I know the dutch one will print 1500-200 copies.
I discuss SH404SEF as the major SEO extension there.
As a consolidation, I am working a bit on promoting SH404SEF. I have self-published this book: http://www.amazon.com/Joomla-SEO-Performance-Simon-Kloostra/dp/1500478288
However, this book will be published by profesional publishers next month: Apress (English) and a known dutch one. I know the dutch one will print 1500-200 copies.
I discuss SH404SEF as the major SEO extension there.
wb_weeblr
Very cool. Actually, I already had some requests on some getting started guides, or general SEO books. I planned on collecting books, tutorials and videos from the web, and put up a page with that list, bu tyours ia good starting point.
Last thing on your site: on my local copy, I tried saving sh404SEF configuration, and it failed, syaing "Another article already has the alias".
That's because - probably while using Josetta - you changed the language of the 404 article from "*" to "English". As sh404SEF only handles the "*" language when saving its config, aliases for the two pages collides.
You should switch back that language to "*". If you do a Dutch version of the page, then maybe you want to do it from Joomla backend, not from Josetta, as Josetta will save the original as en-GB again, recreating the problem.
I may have to do something about it in one or both extensions!
Rgds
Last thing on your site: on my local copy, I tried saving sh404SEF configuration, and it failed, syaing "Another article already has the alias".
That's because - probably while using Josetta - you changed the language of the 404 article from "*" to "English". As sh404SEF only handles the "*" language when saving its config, aliases for the two pages collides.
You should switch back that language to "*". If you do a Dutch version of the page, then maybe you want to do it from Joomla backend, not from Josetta, as Josetta will save the original as en-GB again, recreating the problem.
I may have to do something about it in one or both extensions!
Rgds
system
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